From what you told, -alice2003(飞雪@羊年更美好) @埃德蒙顿华人论坛:埃德蒙顿枫下论坛 The Rolia Forum of Edmonton

工作学习 / 事业与工作 / IT 的， Telecommunication 的，请进来小憩 -bugfree(BugFree); 2002-12-27 {627} (#938412@0)
今年的“冬天” 特别冷，
沮丧的也好，高兴的也罢，
请谈谈的你的想法，我们新IT移民的出路在何方？？
我想在这最困难的时候，也应该是考验我们中华儿女的时刻，
我们需要的是团结，互相鼓励，相互支持，互通讯息，共同进步，
试想可能在不远的将来，
凭借我们华人聪明的头脑，也会创造印度移民在米国的奇迹，
我不想唱高调，
我们的长远目标就是 “将白人去做更有意义的事去吧，
将IT让给我们聪明的华人兄弟”

开此贴子的目的，主要是看到有些兄弟姐妹，最近互相拆台，互相攻击，我想我们作为IT界的精英，是新移民的中坚力量，我们应该带领大家，开创一些局面，找到一些出路.....

认为我说的对的附和几句，
认为我在瞎扯的就骂几声吧，

这不是"小憩"啦. -mage(馅饼); 2002-12-27 (#938417@0)
回流吧。现在和将来的市场和希望在中国。 -resp4child(教育基金); 2002-12-27 (#938420@0)

我刚贴了篇，谈回流的帖子，读读吧，也欢迎留下高见 -bugfree(BugFree); 2002-12-27 (#939547@0)

:`.(.`.`.`.` -sinodeer(白丁--枫下守望者); 2002-12-27 (#938563@0)
我觉得现在加拿大布满了干柴，就差人去点燃啦。 -621103(binzhenjing); 2002-12-27 (#938732@0)
招砖ing…… -charlesdong(charlesdong); 2002-12-27 {82} (#938800@0)
华人的一个要命的地方就是个个都好像挺聪明，其实是小聪明，大愚昧。是谓“大愚若智”。

砖头一块 -ssi(文文); 2002-12-27 {66} (#938808@0)
说得对，真正有大局观的有，稀少，比大熊猫珍贵多了，可惜成不了气候！

那中国人民怎么办呢？ -nokidding(nokidding); 2002-12-27 (#939352@0)

就自己选择活法贝，忍气吞声地活着。。。。。。。。。。。 -ssi(文文); 2002-12-27 (#939369@0)

Please check your e-mail: sswin01@yahoo.com. Concerning the room you are renting.... Thanks. -lhjln(); 2002-12-27 (#939378@0)

Check yours please. -ssi(文文); 2002-12-27 (#939652@0)

which one? there is no new mail in my hotmail mailbox, nor my rolia e-mail... -lhjln(); 2002-12-27 (#939668@0)
Will you be back to Toronto tomorrow? When? I will call you then. Thanks. -lhjln(); 2002-12-27 (#939703@0)

这种话不如不说，听了真泄气！ -nokidding(nokidding); 2002-12-28 (#940246@0)

Why only white guy can 做更有意义的事去? -letitsnow(hot); 2002-12-27 (#939626@0)

那不是为了把IT职位让给我们华人嘛。至于什么事情更有意义，咱们也不知道，所以就麻烦白人（就是白吃的人）去发现一下吧。 -landrovergg(路虎); 2002-12-27 (#939659@0)
"更有意义的事" 吗，开此贴时，我也不知道，可能是种田之类也算吧我们学学印度佬，他们不是用十几年证明了作软件白人不行，我们需要重新证明一下 -bugfree(BugFree); 2002-12-27 (#939773@0)

给你一砖,洗头了吗? -mcsdocp(刘三姐夫); 2002-12-27 {125} (#939692@0)
你以为你是谁? IT的精英? 移民的中坚? 这是什么心态?!
我们不过和所有新中国来的移民一样,只是一个普通人而已,没什么比别人高的地方!

谢谢 mcsdocp (刘三姐夫) 给我一砖头，但是小弟的愚见。。。。 -bugfree(BugFree); 2002-12-27 {217} (#939839@0)
正是大多数人的观点像你那样，才致使我们的很多新移民不团结，互相拆台，甚至有些损人利己
我们中间因该有些人先站出来的时候了，将大家组织起来，在白人也好，黑人也罢，看起来，
华人是一个抱成团的整体，异口同声，不好欺负。

clap! -letitsnow(hot); 2002-12-28 (#939963@0)

attitude, attitude, attitude. always look up yourself. your post is good about this. -tongcd(zombie); 2002-12-27 (#939733@0)
Latest news about lay-off: BCE(Bell Canada, Bell Mobility, Sympaticio....) will cut 1700 employees. -resp4child(教育基金); 2002-12-28 (#940424@0)

这算嘛最新News？一个月以前就报道了。 -fatboy(大胖墩儿厨); 2002-12-28 (#940435@0)

It was annouanced Dec 17. -resp4child(教育基金); 2002-12-31 (#946386@0)

这帖子停留也有两三天了，看来IT工作难找，有没有通讯的前辈们的消息阿？比如说NOTEL, Lucent or Bells.... -theares(班门斧); 2002-12-31 (#946143@0)

我认识的去年被LAY的NORTEL前辈基本上全都找到工作，不过今年又有被LAY的。 -resp4child(教育基金); 2002-12-31 (#946264@0)
TELUS LAYOFF 6000， BCE EMERGCE 600， BCE 1700， FIDO 可能要关门了。GT，360。。。 -resp4child(教育基金); 2002-12-31 (#946267@0)
what do you want to know about nortel?? Please write deatails.. -alice2003(飞雪); 2002-12-31 (#946335@0)

Nortel有optical在谈项目吗? -playtiger(秋去冬来, 望春风); 2002-12-31 (#946482@0)

Metro. -alice2003(飞雪); 2002-12-31 (#946526@0)

股票。。。也像飞雪兄一样，热抄他一把，赚它一大笔。。。呵呵最好明年招人的话，混入他们内部，搞不定会混些便宜股票对不起，班门弄斧了，呵呵。。。 -theares(班门斧); 2003-1-1 (#948383@0)
Sorry to 飞雪，我是搞电信的，即将移民，现在只知道Notel 是Cａｎａｄａ的电信龙头。自知在电信低迷的今天，进入Notel是不可能，想借此机会了解一下多伦多电信业的整体情况，望不吝赐教。 -theares(班门斧); 2003-1-1 {192} (#948385@0)
不过谈到股票，也就象多说几句，知道飞雪兄也是作长线的，我的愚见Notel是一支千里马，在国内电信业同行评价甚高（主要原因有二，技术先进和政府支持），如有闲置资金，收它几万股，日后定会成就气候。。。

班门斧啊 -handler(憨豆乐不起来了); 2003-1-1 {303} (#948404@0)
偶认为现在加拿大找到IT专业工作的几率小于5%，电信可能<0.5%?偶不是统计专家，VC++想找电信工作<0.05%，因为很多公司不用VC做开发。

至于Nortel,加拿大的人都知道它的名声，顶风臭千里。。。就象newsgroup一个鬼佬无辜的辩解：we did nothing wrong, we just worked for Nortel, we are not responsible for everything...
Happy New Year! -alice2003(飞雪@羊年更美好); 2003-1-1 {1404} (#948454@0)
本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛I don't know about Telecom. sector in Toronto area, and only know a little bit Telecom. in Ottawa where there are a lot of Telecom. companies. Nortel's optical & wireless R&D department reside here. Currently Nortel's optical long_haul continues to lay off, and Metro. is better than long_haul. Its wireless is still recruiting people but most of them belong to internal transfer and networking is really really important at this time. Due to whole Telecom. & Nortel's downturn, many related companies in Ottawa are affected including JDS etc. A lot of layoffs from telecom. are in the job market right now. Part of them got new offers again (The better his job opportunity is, the earlier layoff is) which mostly came from federal government including NRC & CRC and outside ottawa(U.S, Toronto, Calgary..), part of them switched to other sectors like financial, part of them went back to China to find some business chances, part of them went back to school to update their technology and part of them are still looking for...As so far I know, some of small companies maybe hire people next year, but who exactly knows? This downsize makes lots of people feel fear especially for those people who already lived oversea for many years because they never think this time was their turn.

Anyway, there are some people who find jobs and other people who lose their jobs at any time. Good luck to you!更多精彩文章及讨论，请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net
兄弟，搞ＶＣ的就是几年前ＮＯＲＴＥＬ也不会要。不过那个时候招不到人人家看你的电信背景或许也会凑合考虑。现在这种形势最好还是在国内呆着比较现实一点。 -416(死要留); 2003-1-1 {496} (#948498@0)
要想读书的话也应该在国内把英语考完再说，这里的生活费用比国内可高了很多。看到银行里的钱越来越少，你的心情会越来越糟。在这里搞电信的，以前是两种情况比较好找工作，一种是ｕｎｉｘ（Ｓｕｎ和ＨＰ）Ｃ＋＋开发系统级应用，一种是用ＶｘＷｏｒｋｓ做板子上的软件开发。ＶＣ在电信级的不多，主要是一些小公司在用。不过现在是什么都不好找。

说道ＮＯＲＴＥＬ的股票，这里很多人也认为有收藏价值，如果它不倒，悟几年肯定能赚。可是一是谁知道它会不会倒？二是很多人就因为这种想法在它从１００多一路往下走的时候被套在里面。

C++ and Java (Unix) plus Oracle are mostly used in optical and wireless parts -alice2003(飞雪@羊年更美好); 2003-1-1 (#948503@0)

实话说我主要搞交换机软件测试工作，熟悉sun 的unix平台 -theares(班门斧); 2003-1-1 {294} (#948517@0)
（使用和系统管理），及其上的此c/c++. Windows平台没有太多经验，只是现在兴趣所在，想以后借此混口饭吃。。。
Java的不会， oracle没用过，但是熟悉mySQL. 也能勉强用php,mysql涂鸦个web程序，不知能不能混饭，先谢谢各位的指点。。。。
另：我的搭档方向是c#, 水平吗简直是牛，不知就业如何，一并谢了。。。

From what you told, -alice2003(飞雪@羊年更美好); 2003-1-1 {648} (#948560@0)
I do believe you can easily find jobs during IT booming years but a little bit hard in Telecom. currently. I think you can enhance your database part plus java to find jobs as a web or database developer in many sectors such as government, bank, many software companies or other companies. Two of friends found jobs as senior web developers (java & Unix & Oracle) in government deparments which are launching a on_line project for federal government. One of friends found a job as a oracle developer in Post Canada. I am not sure about C#, and you can use it to search jobs through monster or workopolis to check if it is useful or not right now...
Forget to tell you, you can track this company's career post. Its performance is more better in Ottawa and its recruiting news are real & always has new posts. When you see red "New" symbol beside position, you submit your resume. -alice2003(飞雪@羊年更美好); 2003-1-1 (#948574@0)
Moreover, this company likes new immigrants and it is top canadian software company. -alice2003(飞雪@羊年更美好); 2003-1-1 (#948575@0)

再次感谢飞雪兄弟的热情帮助，如果有机会定当结交你这位朋友 -theares(班门斧); 2003-1-1 (#948579@0)

给你泼点冷水 -416(死要留); 2003-1-1 {275} (#948744@0)
找交换机软件测试的工作基本不会有戏。飞雪说的那种机会是有，可是竞争的人更多，现在已经不是几年前学个JAVA再编编简历就有人信的时候了。我的朋友JAVA，ORACLE都很熟，被LAY了一年也没找到工作。估计劝你不来也不可能，反正你还年轻，锻炼锻炼也未尝不是好事。顺便问一声，你是不是上海BELL的？

Even the economic state will be better this year or next year, do the tele/software companies need that many people ? I do think most of IT guys and gals cannot get decent job, even job in the future. -88203(kevin); 2003-1-1 {90} (#948477@0)
Nortel will keep its shape in two or three years. It will not make the same mistake again.

Make sense. I always think so-called IT bubble will be never coming again... -alice2003(飞雪@羊年更美好); 2003-1-1 (#948493@0)

Thanks to 飞雪, handler, 88203(kevin), 对我们搞电信的来说， -theares(班门斧); 2003-1-1 {381} (#948508@0)
不作这个还能做啥哪？我现在在一家外资的电信公司干活，现在看来今年的电信市场会持续低迷，因为来自中国的订单是国际大的电信的岁入的重要来源，今年看来联通订单不会有太多，电信，网通要整顿，移通几年都没出大的订单。所以国内肯定也不好过，估计也躲不过接下来几轮公司的layoff，索性还是移加，大不了从头开始读书，转行。。。
各位搞通信的兄弟们，希望大家讲讲你们的想法？先谢谢了。。。。。

Try to find job first and meanwhile apply universities. After you get Ph.d, maybe you have more options(NRC's research staff or university teacher which are more stable job positions). -alice2003(飞雪@羊年更美好); 2003-1-1 (#948514@0)

谢谢飞雪前辈的教诲。。。 -theares(班门斧); 2003-1-1 (#948523@0)

鄙人也做了6年的电信，非常纯洁的6年就只做信令。不过，现在的情况好像很难找工作，正打算考了G牌，转行，要求不高，够养活我就行，喜欢平平常常的生活。 -mashimaro(长不大的流氓兔); 2003-1-1 (#949020@0)

忘了说，考了一个HP UX的认证，好像在这边也没什么用，真不知道该怎么办？哪位大侠能指点一下？先谢谢了！ -mashimaro(长不大的流氓兔); 2003-1-1 (#949025@0)

列位请赐教，现如今那个认证还有用？ -letitsnow(hot); 2003-1-2 (#951102@0)

NONE。怀揣一打认证，却在打累伯的人一大队。 -resp4child(教育基金); 2003-1-2 (#951117@0)

@Edmonton

From what you told,

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