算10%原创吧，说说你的选择，没有对错，只是你听了之后的感受 -westking(westking) @埃德蒙顿华人论坛:埃德蒙顿枫下论坛 The Rolia Forum of Edmonton

工作学习 / 事业与工作 / 算10%原创吧，说说你的选择，没有对错，只是你听了之后的感受 -westking(westking); 2009-9-8 {1654} (#5534765@0)

I would do the things my boss asked me to do first. -hkchan(0); 2009-9-8 (#5534831@0)
典型的受累不讨好. 你忙什么, 老板知道吗? -dvd(weiwei); 2009-9-8 (#5534895@0)
我有点同意第三个和第五个朋友的话。不过要是老板的情商太低或就是对你一个人这样，还是赶快跳槽吧。 -ttennis(ttennis); 2009-9-8 (#5535035@0)
第九个朋友说：什么老板，把TA炒了得了 -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-9 (#5535363@0)
第十个朋友说：老板居然对你大呼小叫，不想活了，去法院告他！ -robos(不错); 2009-9-9 (#5535506@0)
第二个，职场最好境界是体现得象根木头，不管老板如何叫吼，做到无动于衷，可惜我做不到。 -tjhong(我检讨); 2009-9-9 (#5535604@0)
是朋友说得我都听，我同意每个人的意见，虽然就我个人来说，第一个朋友会有点GAY. 第六个朋友会有点娘娘腔，第七个朋友会有点BT, -buma(。。。。); 2009-9-9 (#5535633@0)
同意第3个。另外，老板交代的事情应该priority高一些；容易忘记事情，要随手把to-do list 记下来, 养成好习惯。 -zoomin(舍*得,不舍不得); 2009-9-9 (#5535818@0)
"我花钱用你不是让你整天坐着无所事事!" -- 对这样的人渣,就一句: FUCK YOU OFF !!! 走人. 世界上好老板多的是,看你是不是用心去找. -nicetomeetyou(蓦然回首彩虹跨天地); 2009-9-9 (#5535836@0)

我倒是用心找了，快两个月了，还是没有机会啊 -lmotorcat(机器猫); 2009-9-9 (#5536722@0)

别着急，经济正在好转，我祝你成功。 -nicetomeetyou(蓦然回首彩虹跨天地); 2009-9-9 (#5536811@0)

大家都希望如此，但谁知道是不是真的呢？只有失业率下降才算数，但估计最早要到明年春天才下降。 -newsky(rat); 2009-9-9 (#5536835@0)

加拿大加工企业多，自主创新的企业少，现在对工人的需求增加了。 -nicetomeetyou(蓦然回首彩虹跨天地); 2009-9-9 (#5536837@0)

第一，这种事不会在我的工作中发生。第二，我的老板不会这样对我说话。第三，我不会跟朋友探讨这种问题。 -nww(西北偏西); 2009-9-9 (#5537455@0)
这是缺乏沟通的后果。 -kangkang2009(kang kang); 2009-9-10 {203} (#5539522@0)
记住，下次你的领导给你临时任务时，问一句：“优先级是什么？”如果是NO1，那么你就要先作这个。这一次不要太在乎，第二天抓紧完成就是。另外一个人有这么多朋友不容易，珍惜他们，无论他们的见解怎样。难得的是真心。

"要当天完成" - I think the priority is quite clear! -hkchan(0); 2009-9-10 (#5540522@0)

换个角度来看这个问题。设想一下，你是老板，有一件非常重要的一定/必须要当天完成的事，你交待给了手下的一个，你也很忙，到下班才有时间来问，结果手下说今天太忙啥也没做。 -mimier(mimier); 2009-9-12 {258} (#5543739@0)
这个老板说话比较直接。换个委婉的，说出来不那么呛，意思是一样的。

所以我觉得，就算遇上一个很好的老板，这件事也够你郁闷的。谁让你做错了呢。
还是赶紧想法补救要紧。

priority是最重要的。因为实际工作中有些事如果不能及时完成，会造成巨大的损失，谁也承受不了。

I would be very upset and even if I don't abcxyz, I would remember it during your annual performance review. And the worst part is you would have to try very hard to earn my trust! -hkchan(0); 2009-9-12 (#5543942@0)
这个老板暴露了几个问题，沟通能力差，安排能力差，工作不细致，出了问题没解决办法，只会推卸责任，并且脾气暴躁。在这种能力平庸脾气暴躁的人手底下干，不会有前途，赶快跳槽为是。 -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-13 {516} (#5544293@0)
沟通双方都有责任，但经理负主要责任。
如果你把紧急的事安排给一个已经100%负荷的兵，又没有对应的减负，你还预见不到可能出的问题。这能力实在难让人恭维。
“我花钱用你不是让你整天坐着无所事事! ” 这个经理都不知道自己的兵在忙什么，估计他自己真的是“整天坐着无所事事”了。
既然是非常重要的事，中间总要follow-up一下吧？黑莓发个email，路过问下进度，都不用一分钟吧。
出了问题，总要有对策，加班加点？还是发个email和对方或上司沟通一下？经理人的价值就体现在处理问题的能力上。发脾气有什么用呢？
出了事，当众埋怨下属，更是大忌。

这个老板最大的问题是 -nww(西北偏西); 2009-9-13 {24} (#5544904@0)
居然雇了这么个人作手下。

sometime he has no chocie. When you take a new job, you may be the only new guy in your team. -hkchan(0); 2009-9-13 (#5545272@0)
That is true. Communication is bi-direction. So, for a manager weak in communication, one solution is to require his/her resources to be more proactive to compensate. Unfortunately, it is a very fragile model. -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-14 (#5545750@0)

You know the most challenging part of management in a company is how to manage your boss. Yes, a lot of them are not competent but so what. He is the one who decides your bonus, raise, promotion every year. -hkchan(0); 2009-9-14 (#5545790@0)

I am not as pessimistic as you are. In my whole career in Canada, I have never seen any manager like this. So, I strongly recommend to change a team/company, unless some one want to prove himself (herself) able to please a jerk. -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-14 (#5547993@0)

unfortunately, my experience was the more senior the person is, the bigger a jerk he was as well. Did you ever receive an email from your CIO to ask you to prepare a report after 7 pm and expected it would be ready by tomorrow 7 am; -hkchan(0); 2009-9-14 {101} (#5548130@0)
so that he could be ready for his 9 am meeting. The meeting was scheduled with IBM over a month ago.

did he tell his manager he was overloaded when his manager ask him to do such emergency job? I always do and ask what jobs I should postprone. -hkchan(0); 2009-9-13 (#5545267@0)

As I explained, both parties made mistakes in communication, but the manager is more responsible for addressing the issues in communication path. If you were the boss of his manager, do you think the manager is competent? -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-14 (#5545748@0)

this is the way I protect myself. As a matter of fact, even if my utilization drop below 80%, I would also let my boss know. But in this particular case, the boss was very clear "要当天完成". But I think the boss has lower EQ. -hkchan(0); 2009-9-14 {610} (#5545780@0)
Of course, you may argue the boss should monitor the progress of any work. But when it comes to preformance review,do you give better review to those you don't need to monitor and review but get the work done or those you have to review everyday.

There was 1 time, my CIO yelled at me in front of 2 VPs "I paid you all these money to bring trouble to me!". I had a problem that I couldn't solve, I took it up to my department head and then we discussed with another VP. None of us could solve the problem since it was something to do with a 3rd party. What should I do with my CIO. He was the boss.

All your discussion here are under the assumption that "you were NOT the boss". My point is if you were the boss, you should take the responsibility to resolve it. -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-14 (#5547341@0)

I used to be a system director and I reported to my department head. And if my boss told me to get the work done by end of today. I would make sure it would get done! And if it is a job impossible, I would let him know ASAP. -hkchan(0); 2009-9-14 {162} (#5547708@0)
And if I am busy so I told my manager to do it by the end of the day, I would expect it is done promptly. Very simple! There is no issuee in communication path.

If my manager failed to get it done, I would take full responsibiltiy of the failure but I would not trust the manager again! -hkchan(0); 2009-9-14 (#5547717@0)

Of course! And, do you care about whether he told his direct report in the morning to get it done? I guess no. -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-14 (#5547758@0)

In the origianl post, I read "要当天完成". I think the communication is very clear! There should be no misunderstanding! -hkchan(0); 2009-9-14 (#5547783@0)

You must forget there are many outstanding tasks which need to be finished by yesterday. -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-14 (#5547790@0)

if you had 5 managers and 20+ developers, I hope you could remember one of your staffs had many outstanding tasks to be completed at what day. I don't have such good memory! -hkchan(0); 2009-9-15 (#5548134@0)

If you have 5 managers, why do you micro-manage each developer? -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-15 (#5548166@0)

Let me ask you this: Did the manager in the original post do what you did? NO! It's not about whether he told his boss immediately. He should follow-up and ensure it is done! -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-14 (#5547751@0)

who should follow up? -hkchan(0); 2009-9-14 (#5547784@0)

The manager. -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-14 (#5547788@0)

I don't see how your example relevant. Somehow, I feel the CIO is correct. At management level, you have to deliver results and solutions. Finger pointing to 3rd party (same as to ppl reporting to you) is not acceptable. Or, -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-14 {322} (#5547845@0)
can you imagine the CIO tell the CEO that there is no solution or do you expect the CIO to find out solution by himself? You don't seem to be aware of the difference of responsibilities of job levels. You are okay with VPs acting like a developer and expect (maybe even junior) developer to be as proactive as a manager.

I consider developer is a professional staff like accountant, trader, analyst and I don't like to baby sit them. -hkchan(0); 2009-9-15 (#5548139@0)

Then you might end up with telling CIO that you cannot deliver on time because XXX in your team did not do what you told her to do in the morning. Do you think CIO would buy your arguments and trust you? Why should he pay you as a manager if -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-15 {33} (#5548173@0)
you just work as a voice machine?

Yes, I would take full responsibility if I failed to deliver. I don't point finger to my staff; it was always my fault if I could not manage them. -hkchan(0); 2009-9-15 (#5548184@0)

I know you will as I know you were a good manager. But, what we are discussing is whether the manager in the original post (not you) handled the case appropriately. I believe you would also say no. -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-15 {324} (#5548207@0)
He assumed everything would go right, ignored all risks, failed to check progress, did not manage emotion properly, and most important, did not have any action plan when failure occurred.

To be clear, I never said the assignee did not make mistakes. But, this branch was started with the assumption "you were the boss".

Agree, he is not a good manager. Yelling people would not solve any problem! You may not believe me if I told you I always put 100% margain on every project I managed. In case something failed, I could still fix it. -hkchan(0); 2009-9-15 {417} (#5548212@0)
I would rather no take the project if the user is not OK with my schedule / budget!

the message I want to put here is trust can be very fragile and gone before you even notice; especially it is from your boss. I learnt this in a very painful way and I don't any Rolian follow my footstep.

I respect your effort and I am not trying to argue with you in any way. Just want to share my 2 cents worth experience.

so if you were the manager, how do you communicate to your workers if you want a job to be done by the end of today? -hkchan(0); 2009-9-14 (#5547712@0)

I wonder if you read my post. By pointing out his problems, I listed what he could have done. For your convenience, let me list them inside -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-14 {1241} (#5547971@0)
本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛Find the right resource;
Make sure the assignee have time to get work done;
Let the assignee know this task has the highest priority;
If the assignee covers other emergency issues, e.g. product support, ask other team members to be ready to help in case emergency pops up;
Follow up around lunch time (thru email, IM, or step by), so that I can still turn around if there is any issue;
-------
When it still does not work out at end of day, I have to make a decision (to work around or notify my boss/client/partner) as soon as I know I cannot make it.
If I think it is the assignee's fault, I would schedule an 1-on-1 session the next day to let him/her know how to improve.

All of above are just common sense an outsider can suggest. As an insider, a manager can do much more or less to ensure a task done.

Last but not least, when I mean communication path was broken in the original post, I was not only referring to the fact that the assignee did not understand the priority, but also more about the fact that the manager was entirely out of the loop when there were so many emergencies happened during the day. A potential reason is that the manager is not open to listen, if you consider his behaviour at end of the day.更多精彩文章及讨论，请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net

How many staffs did you manage? If I have to remind my staffs about a job that I passed over to him 4 hours ago; I would be a professional reminder. I would stop here and I just want to say it one more! We must earn the trust from our boss! -hkchan(0); 2009-9-15 {240} (#5548150@0)
Missing deadline, especially one that was just mentioned in the same day morning proved only 1 thing!

But I agree with you the manager was not professional as well. I would never yell to my staff because I don't like people yell to me!

I don't think it is about reminding. One has to check progress for the tasks on one's priority list. Even when your staffs are working on the task, how do you know there is no blocks in the way? I never feel comfortable if -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-15 {73} (#5548189@0)
I don't know the status of a critical job on the day to deliver. Do you?

Yes, I agree with you. As a matter of fact, I was the one who proposed and implemented a formal project management software in my company. I didn't know how other managers could manage every project on Excel. -hkchan(0); 2009-9-15 {457} (#5548198@0)
And I had control on every deliverable, there must be a second people who check, review and signoff every work item.

However, if I only asked for a small job (e.g. prepare a report that may only take 30 minutes) and I said it must be ready today; then I am afraid I would not remind him and follow up with his status. I had high expectation on my professional staffs.

But the key message I want to sent out is "earn your trust and don't break it".

能有这么多朋友有时间来倾听，如果我是当事人，已经很满足了，说明我这个人还行，并不象老板说的那样无所事事；若真的无所事事，就不会有那么多好朋友了．但第二天一早我会找老板谈谈： -ninini(茫茫然); 2009-9-13 {538} (#5545421@0)
首先承认自己把事情忘了，没做，是自己的过错．第二，向老板说明一下当天自己都做了哪些事情，而忙了一整天；第三，如果前一天下班时老板才来问事情做的结果，说明老板也不在乎第二天一早完成；问问几点是最后可以弥补的时间，告诉老板自己会马上行动，给出明确时间，几点钟前一定完成．
老板也是人，当时也许真的是一时冲动，才说出了那些不尽人情的话，说不定他回家后也后悔了呢，他心里也想找机会解释一下呢．第二天上午当你完成并交出任务后，他兴许会说些抱歉的话．
但以后得记住：老板雇你来，你就是来侍候老板的．多与老板沟通，让老板来决定哪件事是最TOP PRIORITY的．

Good for you! We all made mistake; the important thing is how we learn from our mistake and never do it again! -hkchan(0); 2009-9-14 (#5545793@0)

是搂主的错吗？其实是老板水平的低下。 -nicetomeetyou(蓦然回首彩虹跨天地); 2009-9-14 (#5547392@0)

If I missed the deadline of a direct order from my boss; especially the order was given in the morning of the same day; I considered it was my fault! In today business environment, multi tasking is definitely a must! -hkchan(0); 2009-9-15 {377} (#5548160@0)
If I am overloaded, I would discuss with my boss to either cut the quantity or quality. He could cut me at the end but I hate surprise so I don't want to surpirse other people. At least, I would inform him the situation. Most bosses I worked for were very reasonable!

The only time I remind 1 particular staff constantly; she was a summer student referred by another VP.

“如果前一天下班时老板才来问事情做的结果，说明老板也不在乎第二天一早完成；”==> 这个假设很多时候不成立。正确的做法是“问问几点是最后可以弥补的时间，告诉老板自己会马上行动，给出明确时间，几点钟前一定完成．” -mimier(mimier); 2009-9-14 (#5547953@0)

哈哈，回答跑题得多。知道LZ这个测试出处吗？大家刚在亲亲宝贝学习完不久呢，看来当爸爸的少有看过这本书的。 -lucylucy(lucylucy); 2009-9-14 (#5545901@0)

出处重要吗？I have more fun debating off topic. -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-14 (#5548072@0)

呵呵，别误会，出处不重要，一点不重要。只是乍一看到亲亲宝贝的学习内容跑过来了觉得挺有意思的。其实回答跑题但没跑了核心，核心就是communication，这确实是个值得研讨的大课题，大家继续。。。 -lucylucy(lucylucy); 2009-9-16 (#5552145@0)

呵呵，能和值得尊敬的对手认真的争论，跑题也开心。 -majorhomedepot(马甲后的炮); 2009-9-16 (#5553377@0)

westking, I hope you understand I am not here to criticize you. Your boss is not professional and has low EQ. However, I wish you to understand it takes very long time to earn the trust from your boss but 1 single failure can destroy it. -hkchan(0); 2009-9-15 {155} (#5548181@0)
I just wish you can learn from your short fall. I made a lot of stupid mistakes in my career. We may start a new thread and see who is the biggest loser!

@Edmonton

The Blog of westking

算10%原创吧，说说你的选择，没有对错，只是你听了之后的感受

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