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First job: getting the interview.

本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛I've worked as a programmer in Canada and the US for many years through quite a few jobs. I've been interviewed many times and have also interviewed a lot of candidates. I always wanted to share my ideas with new comers. Recently I found Rolia and thought it to be a good media. At first, I thought to write a big article. However, I never found a nice chunk of time to sit down. Now I feel maybe I should just write something down whenever I have a moment. Here's the first installment.

Sorry for writing in English. It kills me to write in Chinese. Even a short sentence could take me 2 minutes to type. Besides, I feel anyone who's looking for professional job here should be able to read English.

The most important thing in your job search is to get the interview. Normally, you won't get the interview unless you have the relevant experience. So if you don't have the experience, you have to make it up.

Many people object to this, but it's a necessity. Everybody does it and if you don't, you'll likely stay jobless. A few years ago, we had to hire a few programmers. We got hundreds of resumes, many of them with excellent experiences. However, lots of the "better" ones we selected for phone interview couldn't pass even the basic questions. Most of these people are Indians (sincere apologies to some Rolians). With so many great resumes out there, your resume goes directly to the garbage bin if it can't pass a 15 second scan.

Making up experience isn't as wrong as it seems. What matters to the employer is whether you can do the job. If you turn out to be the best person for the job, even without the required experience, isn't it good for the employer? A guy I know applied for a job which required experience in a database software. He didn't have but he borrowed the software and worked on it for a few days. To his surprise, he got the job. To his bigger surprise, the Indian girl who's been there for a while didn't know how to do things (again apologies to some Rolians). He ended up being the go-to guy there. When I applied for a job which required a certain hot technology, I bought a book and read it for a week. After I got the job, my boss told me that the interviewer said he's never met anyone who understood the technology so "deeply". If I understand the technology better than anyone else there who's got real experience, isn't it good for the employer that I lied in my resume?

You probably don't have to meet all the requirements of a job. A perfect resume raises suspicion. But you have to meet all the major requirements.

How do I pass the interview if I really didn't have the experience, you might ask. Well, that's your responsibility. One guy applied for a database job for UNIX environment. During the interview, he admitted that he's got no experience in UNIX. Obviously he didn't get the job. He's wasting the company's time. Whatever claims you make in your resume, he have to back them up. Go read a book. Get the software and play with it. Talk to friends about their experience. Otherwise, you're likely to fail the phone interview, like many of the Indians I came across.

What about references? Many places don't check references. None of the jobs I got in the states checked my references. I figure technical people trust their own judgement: as long as you pass the interview, references don't mean much. If they really like you, even a failed reference may not hurt you. When I got a job in a Toronto bank, my former manager in the states offered them some honest opinions about me. It didn't matter in the end. You can also get a friend to be your reference. I once acted as the "manager" of a co-worker and praised him mightily to one of the biggest companies in the world. The guy got the job and worked happily there for many years.

Of course, you can get real experience from volunteer work or from working for non-profit sectors. Should definitely help. But probably not as strong as things you can make up.

Other than relevant experiences, a professional looking resume should also help. Over the years, I've seen way too many sloppy resumes. One resume from a Chinese candidate had 5 spelling errors. One word he spelled wrong is EJB which is the name of a major technology required by the job. Imagine where his resume went. Read many times to correct any spelling or grammar errors. Ask other people to read it for you. Read resumes of people who already got jobs in your field. Format your resume nicely and make sure it's not too crowded or too sloppy. I've read lots of resumes from Indians who frequently leave spaces before punctuation marks. I tend to throw these resumes in the garbage bin. Maybe it's just me but I feel they're likely to be careless.

An English name should also help. Don't cry discrimination. For non-Chinese, it's difficult to pronounce names like "Qiutang". Most people probably couldn't even try it. If a guy named Steve has a resume similar to yours, you can't blame the hiring manager for passing you up. I could never understand why many Chinese still use their native names on their resumes. Even if you don't have a legal Enlish name, pick one for your resume. You can always use your legal name in formal documents. So everyone in the company knows you as Jerry, but accounting sends checks to someone named "Zheqi". It's perfectly normal and very beautiful.

With all my ramblings, I'm not saying you can't find your first job honestly. You might. But it's a lot harder, especially through conventional means.

So long for now. I may write about other things when I get time. Just try to help. If I offended someone, apologies.更多精彩文章及讨论,请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net
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  • 工作学习 / 事业与工作 / First job: getting the interview.
    • so great a post
    • I just want to add my 2 cents worth suggestion - covering letter is your key to an interview.
      Covering letter is the summary of your resume, and it is your 5 seconds sales pitch to sell yourself, why you are suitable and why the manger wants to hire you.

      You should tailor made a covering letter for each job (and probably your resume as well). You may not believe it, they made the decision when they read your covering letter, the resume is a mean to justify their decision, rahter or not to give you an interview.

      And the first paragraph is the most important part of your resume. For those who need to review 20+ applicants would understand my argument. Say each applicant have 1 page of covering letter and 2 pages of resume, you need to read over 60 pages. And believe me, if you are a busy manager, you don't want to go over all 60 pages. You just want to go into details on those interest you.

      Remember, the frist 5 seconds count.
      • All the resumes we got were from recruiters and we didn't get any cover letters.
        • That's because the recruiter would do the selling part on behalf of the applicant. I guess I had bad experience with recruiter and never quite trust them, so I prefer to scan the applicants myself.
      • 阿叔阿,不是我说你,这些在十几年很流行,现在?满地都是中介和走后门的,谁看这个卡我信?
        • I guess you are right, if you are applying the job through recruiter, then a covering letter may not be necessary because the recruiter would do the selling for you.
          However, for people who don't like to go through recruiter, then covering letter is still important.

          I changed more than 10 jobs in Canada, and I always prepared the covering letter myself. I prefer to skip the head hunter or internal HR and sent my application directly to the hiring manager.
    • Good article first of all. Just 2 points: 1. It does not hurt to exaggerate your experience a little, for example, ...
      本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛say 3 year when it is actually 3 month as long as you have done it and know what it is about. However, making up entire non-existing experience, especially it is related to the job's core requirement is difficult. Think about the humiliating situation while you are caught faking your resume :)

      2. Cover letter. Cover letter is supposed to impress the hiring manager with your writing before they digging deeper into your CV. For many our Chinese, if writing is your strength, by no means, go for it. On the other hand, cover letter will only bring you the damage. First of all, needless to say it slows down your resume submitting process significantly, you have to tailor each cover letter according to each different job. Secondly, you are exposing your key weakness, English writing, right away. Think it this way, if you experience is not qualified, you won't be given a job because of an impressive cover letter anyway. On the other hand, if you are qualified, a poorly written cover letter will only make hiring manger think twice about your communication skills, which otherwise, won't be a problem if you don't write them one in the first place.

      Basically, cover letter is the biggest pitfall for our chinese job seekers, unless u are looking for executive type of the job, which it normally requires one. Otherwise, I will suggest you do urself a favor: just don't bother.更多精彩文章及讨论,请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net
      • You can't say 3-yr when it is only 3-month. The general rule is you cannot lie. You can hide something but you cannot lie about something.
        • If you go to the top, you will find out ...
          this thread is talking about how to give non-experienced people a chance help them to land a job which they might be qualified. I am just following the spirit of the first post, so you can see I am more on the conservative side in terms of making up experience... after all integrity and honesty is highly respected...
        • The general rule is you have to lie, Jeff. It's highly debatable that to lie in your resume, especially to get your first job, means you're dishonest. I consider myself to be very trustworthy, but I lied in my resumes.
          • I have never and will never lie on my resume.
            • Good for you, Jeff. For a friend, I might prefer you but I don't have a problem hiring someone who lied in his resume. I actually might even pick him over someone too honest.
              • ??? !!!
        • Agree. I am surprised that they didn't find out during interview and reference check (both formal and informal).
          IT community is quite small in Toronot (at least in financial industry), you can always find a friend's friend who know the applicant.
    • 很好,很受启发。上周发了份简历,和人家贴的job script不是太match, 他们要求的东西和我的专业方向有些偏差,有什么办法补救吗?
      • 说你正在转向那个方向啊
      • 你的简历一定要和job description match, 他要求Java, 你简历一定要有,当然要包括主要的技术要求。 要会高度概括提炼job description.
      • 这个工作要是冷门,没多少人申请,就可以补救。要是有200份简历在桌上,你只能在申请别的工作时多加注意了。
    • 太多,太长。我帮你总结一下:要找工,第一要有料到,第二要敢做假。做苦力是这样,做老总更要这样。。。。
      • 一针见血
      • 哥们,在技术工作上,简历作手脚可以,搞管理就是搬石头砸自己的脚。毕竟北美高管圈子很小,一露馅就没意思了。扫地出门不可避免。搞管理的简历关键是简历写的要有艺术性,撒谎不可取。
    • good.thx
    • very good, tell the truth of job seeking...